Vicki Dau (00:06)
Welcome to Re-Framing Life and Love, where Tom and Vicki guide you on a transformative journey through healing and connection. Together, we explore the profound effects of childhood sexual trauma on adult relationships and share practical tools to help you build a loving partnership. Two things. We do have a trigger warning.
This podcast discusses sensitive topics related to childhood sexual abuse and trauma. Listener discretion is advised. And we have a disclaimer. We want to remind you that we are not medical or mental health professionals. This podcast is based on our personal experiences and what has worked for us. While we aim to provide valuable insights and support,
We encourage you to seek professional advice for any specific mental health or relationship issues which you may have been facing. Now, here is our next episode.
Vicki Dau (01:15)
Welcome to today's episode of reframing life and love with Tom and Vicki. I'm going wait, is my color good? Yes. We're on TV.
I'm gonna tell my story Just to give you guys some background of what happened. You might resonate with some of the items and Yeah, so I I was interviewed actually by one of our future Guests that we're gonna have on our podcast and she had asked me how did I What were the signals that I had that?
maybe about my repressed memories. what I would say is it was like the wake of a boat that if you think about a boat gives a wake. I never had, I never saw the boat. you see the boat or not, Yeah. I never saw the boat, but I saw the wake. So then I knew a boat went by. That's kind of how my gauge is.
And the things that I noticed about myself was, well, I was born and raised Catholic and I took it very seriously and a lot, but a lot of guilt was involved with all that. It was very clear to me that I was going to wait until I got married to be with a man.
And that wasn't a choice that I made. That was like the only option. And I never questioned authority.
Still pretty much don't well we're starting now we're starting to know yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, go ahead. Yeah, that's all another part. that's good. I'll write that down questioning us already. Okay, so I just grew up with that mentality and
Ugh.
I met this wonderful man and I told him I wanted to wait until we got married to be together and he totally respected that. and that point I had no memory of anything with me. even the stuff that happened to you. But you didn't even have memories of a lot of life of stuff that
didn't happen to you because of what happened to you. It was kind of crazy when we look back regular memories. Yeah, yeah. Right, right. Like I would ask you a question about, growing up or whatever and doing this or that. And don't have in your normal response would be, I don't really have a lot of memories of growing up. So I think while this is we know this our bright brains are wired to protect us. And so it will do what it needs to do to keep us safe.
And that's what my brain was doing. The one thing that my mother had always told me is I'm so angry. You're so angry, You're so angry all the time. She actually brought that up to me once. In St. Matthew cafeteria. really? I think Vicki is very angry. I said no, because I didn't want to give her any kudos for anything. But I kind of didn't. This was before.
you knew anything came up and it was like I wasn't gonna go there with any negative. But it always seemed like an insult to me when it was brought up. Like you're so angry. You have a lot of stress. Like get your act together. And she taught you that it was not okay to be angry out loud. You were not allowed to be angry. That was not you were out of control. A person was out of control if they got angry and that's just trash.
Yeah, if I would start to lose my temper, it would be like shut it down. And she would shut it down and then you you would shut it down if anyone ever questioned it, namely me through our boy, this is all coming back now. Yeah. You know, things would come up and I'd say to you, know, you know, why why so angry or, know, or hopefully I wouldn't say, hey, calm down, you know, because that never goes over big. But but you know, if I would question that or call you out on it.
BAM you would flip a switch and you'd be done. Yeah. Yeah. So like I remember using plates as frisbees. I remember one time I got so angry. is horrible. Yeah, that's a little bit funny. Yeah. I took my daughters. I got so angry. I was in the bedroom and the kids had a nightlight and it was a porcelain Virgin Mary, a porcelain thing. had the head of it and I got so angry. I whipped it and it broke.
And, I thought I got all the pieces, but there was one that was in the bed that I didn't know about. my one daughter has a scar on her leg from the Blessed Virgin Mary's porcelain nightlight that I lost my temper about.
Vicki Dau (06:52)
One of the things that I like to do is to show some of my art that kind of documents my journey, I guess. And we talked a lot in here about anger and how I felt and I over the top reactions. I had painted this and that's pretty much how I That I'd move through it. But it was like, yeah, I felt that. It was intense. That intensity, right? Yeah. Yeah.
Sometimes art can speak when we can't. That's where I was at.
Vicki Dau (07:22)
So that I would say that was one of my big things. The other one is I just had this lingering thought that something happened.
with me and a family member. it wasn't right. Yeah, it was weird. It wasn't right. And I remember after our second child was born. So first child was a boy. Second child was a girl. And after she was born, I remember thinking, I feel like there's something up with me. And so I went to Catholic charities for free counseling and you get what you pay for nothing.
But he basically said to me, well, does this describe you? And he gave me a piece of paper. And I remember reading it. I remember thinking, well, I'm not overly organized. I'm not overly obsessed with cleanliness or organization or whatever. Everything was like over the top. I thought, I don't think that was normal for me, right? So it's not over the top. No. So I'm like, I don't feel like.
I feel like this describes me, but I'm not overly any of this. he said, well, I think you're good. I think you're good. Thank you very much for that. Yeah. So we went another, I don't know, what would you say? 18 years. Right. Was that right? Was that right after we got married? The counselor? Yeah. That was after Rachel was born. So she was born? Seven, eight. Well, your memories started coming back 18 years in. So probably. Yeah. gee. Only maybe 14 years.
Yeah. Yeah. So I let it go and raised our kids. I ran a very tight household. We were. I probably we were disciplinarians. We expected the kids to obey and we made them obey and no one just saying in responsible way. The idea of like the gentle parenting thing right now, that was not us.
I feel like we could have done a little bit, then I also feel like there's an element of having the kids obey you. And like if I asked them to come here, if they didn't, I got up and I brought them to me because that's what I needed them to do. I needed that. That's what they needed to do. That's our parents. Yeah. So that's what, how we did things. And so after, yeah, 18 years into the marriage. our, I think we were done having kids then.
We had seven kids here and three in heaven. And I just remember getting the sense of just something not being right. And at the time I was seeing a health kinesiologist who did a lot of...
work with the mind and the body and what was going on in your body and things like that. she bring up using essential oils because that was a part of it also? We had been doing that already with all the kits for like our whole time. there were some oil regimens that you used that we I thought that I thought were part of the process of bringing things out. No, not really. It more her. Yeah, I think it was.
Not that it didn't loosen stuff because I think things were locked down pretty tight. you're right. But she was your bigger. Yeah, that's when it was really clear. Yeah. But I remember the kids were in school and we were going to we had a
school.
when the kids get their report cards and stuff and we had like went in and got their reports of how they were doing. And I remember telling one of the teachers who was a mutual good friend and I said, well, I'm going to a session today to figure out if I was abused or not. And she's like, wow, okay. So anyway, I remember being in the session in the room.
And I remember all of a sudden my body, like my knees and pushing back and like scooting away from the table or like, like physically doing that physically like scooting away from someone. And.
And when the person came to light, it wasn't the person I thought it was. And it was like, wow, okay. And so I came home and told him we're going to in the next episode, he's going to give his interpretation of everything or his feelings about stuff. But so I came home and told him, and we began a journey of truth, truth.
It took me, we actually had a major family function shortly after that. And everyone- On her side of the family. On my side of the family. And I remember, well, I went there and everybody was talking about what a great family we have and how wonderful they are, you know, when they talk about the ancestors and the people that came before you and what a good lineage, what a good example they set and what great people they were and all that.
and I started bawling and I could not stop.
Because in my mind it was like, really? Well, what about this? Meaning the memory. No one. I was literally bawling with my head on the table. I was sobbing for at least an hour or more. No one said a word to me. Nobody. It was like, let's just pretend that she's not bawling her head off. And they didn't know why she was But nobody even asked me. But they didn't even It was like, that was like.
precursor to pretending that nothing is wrong finally at the end of the night somebody came up one of my cousins came up said hey what's up and I don't remember what I said but anyway so I spent a lot of time questioning my story I spent a lot of time challenging my story with yourself with myself I was like how could I forget that how could that be
And the irony of it is when you're 40 years old, 40 to 42, that's about when memories come back. That's like documented. And that's exactly when it was. my gosh. So it was very helpful to talk to her name's Mary Knight. She has a movement where she's trying to share how common it is for repressed memories. And anyway, when I heard some of the facts about it, it was just like, my God, it was so helpful because I felt like
my God, this is normal for this circumstance. And so I am.
I had to navigate who I was going to tell and what I was going to tell to whom. And I told some very close family members and then who then kind of still acted like nothing really happened, right? Yeah, that was then, this is now. Yes, yes. That was the attitude.
which just, you know, fast forwarding, it's a lifelong journey, everybody. That's why we're here to support you on it. Because we figured out it's a lifelong journey. It never goes away. It gets way easier. my God, it gets way easier. But part of the reason I never wanted to talk about it or share was because growing up, the attitude toward rape, incest, sexual abuse was...
Number one, and repressed memories, actually. I remember hearing on I remembered hearing a report on the news about reading something or something about repressed memories. And a very special person said to me, those were planted. It's impossible. You cannot not remember everything. So those memories were planted by her therapist. And then
the other thing that was said by the same person at the time, a treasured, a treasured person to me said, that report came on the news about a girl being raped or something. And the comment was made. Well, was she, what was she wearing? What did she do to deserve it? like what role did she play in the abuse? Almost like putting the responsibility on her. She should have been walking.
Yeah, she shouldn't have been walking on that street. What was she wearing? Was she being seductive? And I remember. And so both of those were firmly planted in my head. And so I just was like, OK, what did I do to cause it? I can't share about this. And I didn't. I went to counselors.
I went to therapists.
The counselor at the time, I started sharing with her some other things that were going on. And what I mean by that is people were telling me things that they had never told anybody else. And it almost like completed the puzzle. And she said, Vicki, there's something bigger here going on than just you. And...
I started getting the feeling that I need to spill the beans. Because what had come out with different people telling me different things was it went back generation after generation after generation after generation, 80 years. You documented with personal testimony, in-person personal testimony. 80 years and no one said a word. And for me, when I was like, you know what, it's done.
It ends with me. I am not letting this go. And another generation that we're going to keep this secret and my kids might be affected. Their kids might be affected. Done. I'm not letting this go any further. So I went to the counselor and I told her that and she said, okay, there's some things you need to know. You cannot do this looking for anything. You cannot do this looking for them to affirm you, looking for them to support you.
expect nothing. Well no she didn't say crap I wasn't I wasn't expecting the total backlash I was expecting nothing but not backlash and the way I decided to handle it there was like 35 family members that I had to tell and the thought was okay if I call John first and I don't get to Phillip up
you know, for the he's not the 15th phone call, the story is going to get around way faster than I will. And it will be. Messed up in a major way. Yeah. So we decided to write a letter. And this this decision came over lots and lots of prayers and lots and lots of time. This was no knee jerk thing. months. No knee this much. This was not a knee jerk to do this. And what I did is I wrote a draft and I.
saved it on the computer and then I would go in one week and change a couple words or read it again and whatever. But I thought because then everybody kept a secret. So we got this family that has this massive rug with all this shit swept under it where the rug is kind of like this, right? Well, I pretty much kind of took the rug back and did that.
I wrote the letter, it's now known as The Letter. And what I decided to do was only address it to my blood relatives. So my aunt that was married to my mother or my uncle.
mother didn't marry your aunt. No, the sibling of the sibling of my mother. Sorry. Your mother's siblings. Yeah. And then my cousins, but not their children, but not the married people, the in-laws, the in-laws, because if they wanted to keep a secret from their spouse, that was their choice. But I wasn't the one that shared this with their spouse and the cousins at the time. So those those
siblings of her mother's kids were of the age where they could handle this. were they were they were older, you know, adult people. They were all adults. It's not like we were it's not like we were trashing little kids or something like that. You got to understand that. And that's why we sent it to that group of people. Yeah. So made copies, addressed them all, put them in the mail. And the shit hit the fan. And I was blacklisted that
the next family event, was the only one that was not invited to this event. And what has happened since is.
Everybody has gone back to, we have a great family. just nothing really happened. There's nothing really wrong. And they went back to the lie that nothing has happened. I have chosen not to be a part of them. And our children have chosen. So what happened after my memories came back? My younger children were pretty young.
and we stopped going to extended family events. the older kids, we did tell what happened, not in detail, but just told them what happened. And then the younger kids, we just said we were kind of vague about it. And then as they grew, we shared with them. That's how we chose to do it. And then what also happened is
We did end up getting invited to something like where all the family was going to be there. And we sat all the kids down with a few of my nieces and nephews where we were all kind of writing together. where we decided to try it out. were invited to a function, graduation party, and we thought, OK, we'll see how people are going to treat me now. It was a while after the letter. And we prepared our kids. We said, OK.
So we want to let you know this is first time we're getting together with this. have no idea how this is going to go. And I'm asking you for your cooperation. If we say it's time to leave, we're asking you to instantly get up and get in the car because that means something happened and I need to get out. Don't don't be like, I want to stay. Can I stay with grandma? Can I stay with you? Yeah, it was awesome. they were incredibly supportive, but
The family still treated me like shit. They literally sat on a table, you know, that far away, looked at me and talked about me while I was there. Like it was really amazing. But we had to do that because it really cemented where things, how it was going to be moving forward for us, which was actually good because it became very black and white. Okay, we're done with you and we can move on without you guys. Yeah. And there's a...
Because who needs it? you're losing your family. don't have those connections. Family is so important. Not that kind of family is it. So it made it very easy to say, no, that's not OK. What they're doing is not OK. We don't need to be a part of that because it's
We're done with the lies and the half truths. so, yeah, that's really powerful. There is an acronym called DARVO, D-A-R-V-O, that explains exactly how my family treated me is exactly, it's like classic how family does things. And so if you go on YouTube and Google DARVO,
And actually we can put some links. I'll put some links in the show notes of there is a woman who had repressed memories and shared them and was treated like this. And there were so many other people that were treated the exact same way. She actually, it's like, it's like classic. The order of what they did and how they did it was classic. What's classic. just didn't realize it at the time. What, what was happening because like it started out where
They picked apart my story. Well, you told so-and-so you were five and a half and you told this one that you were six. You know, you told so-and-so this and you told so-and-so that. So like one of the steps in Darvo is they pick apart your story and then they, but it's, just so amazing how it was classic textbook reaction. Yeah. So we made that decision to be with ourselves and
And it's okay to do that. And shortly no one is asked to because that that that time then with her family became those people that that those relationships were in a different description. It was an abusive scenario. You don't need to stay in abusive situations ever. So we removed ourselves from them. You can remove yourself from them for your safety and well being. And we did and it's especially easy.
It's especially doable when you have somebody here That's supporting you right? That's why we're doing this podcast to support you guys What ended up happening is I had those initial memories come back and then I had some other memories come back with another family member and I confronted that family member and He denied it his response was I never heard any
I never did anything to hurt you or anybody else for that matter. And if I did, why would I admit it? That was the response that I got. was no, my God. I keep putting myself into that scenario thinking if one of my kids came forward saying that I had done something of that nature, knowing that I hadn't, I would be so ripped and torn. I wouldn't even probably be able to speak, much less have the wherewithal to say the things that person said to her and me that day.
almost like it was practiced. Yeah. It was just ridiculous. the actual thing we found out, he was on a lawsuit for sexual harassment at work during that exact time. my gosh, like does the leopard change his spots? and my therapist had also prepared me for that interaction. She said, down what you want to say because you may forget.
and make sure somebody's with you in the room. And so he came home from work and we did it that way. It was probably less than five minutes. So I have it. Thank you. And so that's the initial stuff that went on. The journey of healing.
was a lot. It was some days were way harder. It was really hard in the beginning. I'm not gonna lie. I was going to see a lot of different healers, counselors, therapists. I really, I researched, you know, there was theophostic prayer I did. I went to regular counselor, I did reiki, I did, we did oils, I did, I just was trying to
clear this, would pray before I did everything or make a choice to do something that was different. And what I realized is sometimes my upbringing in a very male dominated rule.
following scenario primed me.
for abuse actually don't question authority obey.
Keep your mouth shut. It's like I was primed for it. so, but within our relationship, we really started. Well, I was very sensitive physically. I asked him to, we had a long time where I asked him not to touch me, stay away. And he did. Fixing the heater, just turn it off.
Go ahead, just turn it off. I tried it won't do it. It had nothing to do. I pushed the off button and it there.
killed it. You're not editing that out. was beautiful. So I, it was really hard. Like he would go to touch me. That was actually another sign we had some, right before my memories came back as he would like sit next to me and rub my arm or rub my leg. It was like not good. And so
I know that happens to a lot of survivors. And so I was just asking for my physical space. It was rough for a couple months. lot of tears shed in different places, you know, different with different people. Memories would continue to come back. Yeah. Pieces of it. So you'd have to revisit the thing again. And then she would share it with me and we'd revisit that. She'd say, Hey, I had another memory today. Yeah.
I tell you and I would say yes always and we worked through it and we would you know we would work through it together but that that it wasn't like boom here's the whole story you know yeah yeah yeah the body the body is so awesome it it let it sift through gently as you can be gentle with something that's horrible but it gently laid it back into her so that we could share it in pieces so that we weren't overwhelmed and
not know what to do which is actually a big thing when you think about it if you had to deal with it all right now boom yeah literally could kill you we didn't have to deal with that because it came back in pieces difficult as it was still the only real still it was a blessing that it came back what ended up coming back was i was abused by two family members and i was raped on a date when i was 18 that one came back he looked like ace
from an American Idol episode. I happened to be seeing his face and I went, my God. And I freaked out because it was like, that's what he looked like, the guy who raped me on a date. And so I think I was drugged because I remember him leading me down the hallway by my elbow. But it was just real spotty memories and never saw him again.
So that's kind of the stuff that ended up coming out. So I kept questioning myself, like almost daily, how could someone forget? When I was 18, for goodness sake, how could I forget that?
but I could because it wasn't an option for me to be with a man before I was married and I would be breaking that rule. you know, I think that's a lot of the reason that that just like shut off. But I do remember after that date, my sister and my best friend at the time.
said to me i kept talking about i wish i would just get raped on a date because then i get it i would get it over with and be out of the way who would say that what that's so weird to say but they said i started talking like that
Maybe you were referring back to that time,
So.
When it was bad, I was like, you know what? I'm tired of being married. I don't want to be with anybody. I just want to be done. And having six kids and not a ton of money, it was like, OK, divorce isn't really realistic. So what's the other option? one of us could die in our sleep. So I would lay in bed wishing for one of us to die.
That went on.
All right. And then.
I looked at who he was and I thought, do I really want to be alone? Do I really? Do I really? Let me look at who this man is. Who would I go to next or would I just be alone? Okay, this man is kind, he's loving, he's an amazing father. He loves me.
not perfect, but he's a great guy. He's like my Prince Charming. So I made a choice that day. I remember flipping the switch and saying, okay, I'm going to get him on the same page with me. I'm going to let them know what's going on, even though it's hard. And we're going to make this work. Made working it so much easier, right? Yeah. So what the little things I would do would be like,
Something came up today. It has nothing to do with you. I need some space though to digest it, but I'll tell you about it tomorrow. And she did. Or something happened. I need to tell you I'm going to get I'm going to yell and I'm going to get upset, but it doesn't have anything to do with you. I just need you to listen. And I let her do that too because that was OK. Yeah. I in that interim I learned a tool called tapping EFT tapping.
and have since become certified in it. So now what I do is when I am upset or arguing, I start tapping and he's like, OK, what's going on now? if the bears are not doing something right or whatever. Yeah, right. Yeah. So but I made choices time after time after time after time to share with him what was going on in here, because if I don't tell him what's going on, he's going to assume that something he did
upset me. I know that he felt for a long time, maybe years, that he was walking on eggshells. Like not knowing what he was going to do or say that would upset me. That would send me off. Because it would.
And so we talked a lot. Some of the conversations were not easy, but we were committed to it because this relationship was not abusive, but we did need to work on it. And so I made choice after choice after choice after choice, and he made a choice to listen and support me on my journey. And it became our journey. We had someone who
shared with us that it's very common that survivors think they have to heal alone because the abuse happened to them alone. So when they're going through their healing, they think they have to heal alone. And that is not true, especially if you're married or you're in a committed relationship.
It's something you decide. Love is a decision that you make day after day after day. There were some really, really hard times, really hard times.
And now, what would you say percentage?
90 of what's good of how good it is.
think it's not I mean it was really hard for a long time right and then it started getting easier so many how often is it difficult yeah yeah yeah yeah okay maybe we're 95 percent 5 % it's bad but yeah but those come and go at the drop of a hat because we we do it the skills that we have learned now we work through we just had something happen last week that took less than 24 hours
to fully talk through and resolve and be in better way for next time. no, I remember distinctly the issue. We'll talk about that in a different one. So one of the big reasons that all happens is because we firmly, this is one of my biggest things. I believe that quality time is only going to come from quantity. You can't just decide to make something quality in a relationship without putting time into it.
And that time could literally be just sitting in the same room with the person. We do it every single night because you never know what might come up that you could talk about over the course of a couple hours, not just a couple of minutes. So quantity makes quality and quality brings healing and closeness and growth and all of those good things that we have now. So that the 5 % that's difficult is difficult for a short time. Once she gets her act together, we figure it out. Boom. Yeah. Yeah.
So yeah, that's kind of my story it is my story and I Invite you if you haven't already to maybe share some of your story with your committed partner
Yeah, that would be good. Indeed. No better action. Yeah. It's never too late to start. I like that. never too late to start. That's good. Thank you. And you will appreciate every step beyond that because every addressing of an issue is a positive step in the healing of it. And then the
nurturing of your relationship so that it can improve because why wouldn't you want it to be better? it's okay. Why wouldn't you want it to be great? Better is always good. called to be a people of increase to expand ourselves to enjoy more, to love more, to give more, to do more. And you can't do that if you're deciding to do it. every little step, little steps, it all works.
Yeah. So don't forget to subscribe so you don't miss an episode. we invite you actually we created these amazing digital guides, one for husband one for wives. If you go to teamdau.com and click on the store tab at the top.
We have a survival guide for husbands and a helping your husband help you guide for wives. They're digital. They go on your phone. There's a table of contents. You can pick a topic and it'll go straight to that topic and there'll be a front of the card and a back of the card. And then we have a video with each topic. Just short, short, like one minute. Yeah. One minute video. But the survival guide for husbands is
everything that he has learned and how he has helped me and the mindset to adopt to make the most of your relationship together. The helping your husband help you for wives was integral because there's things that we need to know as wives and remember and share to help him help us. And so
There's a short little video with both of them with all the topics and we encourage you guys to get yourself put it on your phone put put the put it on your home screen. I still I do it every day. It's mine. I created it and I do it every day to keep me in a great mindset and if stuff is like if this topic is like I can't do that then just go on to something else. Give yourself space and time to grow.
and things do get better. That's why we're doing this, to help you guys to see the benefits of your commitment.
Until next time, this is Tom and Vicki embracing love. embracing love. it is. ready? Here we go. Until next time, this is Tom and Vicki embracing love, fostering hope.
Vicki Dau (43:00)
Thank you very much for joining us on this episode of Reframing Life and Love. We hope you found the inspiration and actionable insights to enhance your relationship. Don't forget to subscribe for more empowering discussions.
